Never Had a Boyfriend

72

By Baileybear

First Kiss When Nearly 22

Yep, that was me. I'm still embarrassed to admit this now, even after I've been married for more than a decade. My husband was my only real boyfriend. I didn't receive my first kiss until I was nearly 22.

I remember being going to a pentecostal church in my uni days, one that had a large following of university students. Each week, several 18 to 20 year olds were getting engaged, to be married shortly after. This was in the early 1990s when people outside the church either weren't getting married at all, or were marrying later in life.

Before I met my husband, I'd never been kissed or even had a guy hold my hand. I was naive and idealistic- partly because of my sheltered pentecostal christian upbringing, and mostly from my undiagnosed Asperger's Syndrome, which I managed to disguise reasonably well.

My friend and flatmate, Vanessa* was never long without a boyfriend - she'd had several. She said one ex-boyfriend was shocked that I'd never had a boyfriend. I was humiliated she'd told people. Apparently the ex-boyfriend said I was attractive. He was hot. He was taken.

I didn't learn about the Asperger's until a few years ago, and figured that I must have been too ugly for guys to be interested in me. After all, a few people at school had told me so.

My only romance "experience" was the multitude of teen romance novels I had read. Unfortunately, they didn't help much, as I was pretty clueless at recognising signals like subtle flirting and attraction.

I'd never been in love, only had the odd temporary crush. I was lonely and wanted someone other than God to love me, really love me, to tell me I was beautiful, to marry me. I couldn't see God. I couldn't hear God. I couldn't feel God's touch. My faith in my invisible God ruled my life and lifestyle.

I didn't talk girly stuff with other girls. I didn't ask the christian girls how they came to acquire boyfriends. A few would toss their hair, wear tight and revealing clothes and laugh a certain way. Perhaps that was it? It didn't make me feel comfortable to try and imitate them. I didn't want to wear slutty clothes. There was no way I was going to deliberately act like an air-head. I was baffled by the whole process of sexual attraction.

Being a geek, when I wanted to know about dating, I read about it in a book. I read some christian books. Vanessa laughed about the dating books - but she didn't offer me any tips. She was older than me. She was experienced. She knew the secret on how to attract guys. When we went to a church ball, she was asked to dance by several males. No-one asked me to dance.

I was shocked about the content of the books and what christians can get up to when dating. I was even more shocked when I overheard christian teens talking about how they messed around - like pretty much everything but intercourse.

Vanessa broke up with a really nice guy and was not single for long. She put a cartoon on the wall of our all-girls flat. It was a skeleton with a handbag sitting on a park bench, covered in cobwebs. The caption said, "waiting for the perfect man." Vanessa was searching for "The One." I wasn't even sure if "The One" existed for me. I'd never even paired up with "Any One."

A pastor visiting our church said a "prophesy" for me. He said "don't be tempted by worldly guys, but wait for the man that God has prepared for you." I was such a prude, I couldn't imagine being tempted by anyone. Males never showed interest in me anyway. I'd certainly never experienced "fireworks". But, being a committed believer, I clung to those words. If they were true, God was going to give me a godly man for a husband.

Primary School Years

I didn't know much about sexual things when I was a child. No-one talked about it. Euphemisms were used - "whistle" or "diddle" for penis and "fanny" for girl's genitals.

I had sisters so I didn't have much opportunity to see penises. I remember the boys next door peeing over the fence and thinking the flaps on their penises were pretty gross.

When I was 6 or 7, I went to stay on Toby's farm. We had baths together, and we compared genitals. Toby had a "whistle" and I didn't.

Toby and I laid side by side in a cot together, naked. I wondered if this was wrong, because we were "sleeping together." I'd heard that phrase somewhere, and wasn't sure what it meant, but knew it wasn't approved of.

As a teenager, I was reintroduced to Toby. We didn't say much. I'm not sure if he felt guilty or embarrassed like I did. Or maybe he just didn't remember me at all.

Childhood Secrets

When I was about 8 years old, teenage male aged around 16 years babysat me and my sisters. I remember playing hangman and couldn't guess the word. It was 'sex' and I thought - that's a rude word, but had no idea what it meant.

He sat on the couch and was cuddling me. Then he unzipped his trousers and pulled out his erect penis. He instructed me to hold it. I was a little apprehensive, but figured it must be okay, because my parents had left us in his care. I thought it was kind of funny how his penis sprung back when I pulled it and let it go.

He took me to the bedroom and asked me to remove my panties. He bent down to look at my 'fanny.' He had a peculiar half-smile on his face. He kept wanting to look and I started feeling anxious. I told him to stop and said I was going to tell Mummy. He said, "no don't do that, it's our secret." I carried the guilt of that secret for years - I thought it was my fault.

To this day, I have blocked out his face, but I know which boy in my older sister's class photos his younger brother is. I can also remember his mother - what she looked like, her first name and that she played netball. I remember going to their house a few times, and watched them draw up insulin for diabetes.

When I finally told my parents when I started cracking apart in my late teens, they were apologetic and said they didn't even think that boy was still alive (might have died from diabetes).

At around the same age, I discovered that if I crossed my legs in a semi-standing position, then I had a very pleasurable feeling come across me, making me grunt away. I had no idea that I was experiencing an orgasm every time I did this. I was horribly embarrassed when years later I figured it out. I'd been told that crossing my legs like this was the reason I had bowed legs.

Pre-teen Years

When I was 11, my best friend was Kaylee, an attractive, flirtatious girl that had big boobs. She was popular with the boys. We had fun chasing some boys trying to whack them with our rulers. Kaylee had a boyfriend, Johnny. I phoned Johnny and asked if he wanted to be my boyfriend. He said yes. Kaylee was mad at me for a few weeks, but then we were best friends again.

Kaylee seemed very sexually aware. She did some things that made me feel uncomfortable, like pash her 5-year-old brother, and have him hold her boobs.  To this day, I wonder if Kaylee was sexually abused.

Johhny walked past my house after swimming training. I would run out with an ice-block for him and we would walk and chat. He gave me a locket and a potplant. That was the extent of our relationship.

Some school friends thought it would be fun to have kissing sessions. As art monitors, some of us had access to the artroom at lunchtime. Several excited 11- and 12-year-olds sneaked inside. I wasn't very excited. They were expecting me to kiss Johnny - or rather pash Johnny for the first time, in front of an audience.

Kaylee and some of the other girls pashed boys - tongues and all. It looked disgusting. I watched uncomfortably as they demonstrated their movie-star skills. Johnny and I were pushed in front of each other. We stood about two feet away from each other, embarrassed. We laughed and walked off. We didn't lock lips. We didn't hold hands. Ever. I cried when Johnny dumped me.

Some of the students reported that they had groped each other in the toilets. I was rather shocked. I couldn't imagine letting any boy putting their fingers where they weren't wanted. I learnt what some few vulgar terms from the other students. I'm not sure how they knew these things. I was a good christian girl, and fairly sheltered and naive.

High School Years

When I was about 14, I found myself checking out a boy in music class. Greg had brown eyes and blonde hair. I didn't usually notice what colour eyes people have, as I don't tend to look at people's faces (typical of people with Asperger's Syndrome - that's one of the reason's subtle communication signals are missed).

I can't remember how it came about, but officially, he became my "boyfriend," - in name only. I was allowed to go to the school social with Greg. At the social, I had a new party trick - if I mouthed the words, "colourful", the boys thought I was saying, "I love you." It was a great joke. When we got home, my sister told our parents I had been flirting with the boys and I got into trouble.

Greg invited me to play on the computer at his house. I was not allowed to go. I was not allowed to spend time with boys. They "would take advantage of me," I was told, but exactly what "taking advantage" involved was not discussed. I thought this was grossy unfair.

Greg and I made a plan to meet in the gully to kiss - I wanted to know what it was like. The only kisses I'd had were wet, sloppy, revolting kisses from relatives at weddings. We met in the gully and stood there for a while - just like with Johnny. I was too gutless to try and kiss him.

Then someone else turned up, I breathed a sigh of relief and we had an excuse to abandon it. Once Greg tried to hold my hand - I was embarrassed, and pulled away, and ran to catch up to a female friend. I can't remember who dumped who. I don't think it was me.

Sometime later, a girl from my class rang to inform me she'd played tonsil hockey with Greg. "Greg's a great kisser, isn't he?" she said. "How would I know," I said, "we never kissed."

My blog, godconfusion

Born-again Christian

During my high-school years, I went from becoming a christian to a "born-again" christian and become even more careful to screen out any thoughts about boys. Thinking about sex was equivalent to having sex, according to Jesus. I loved Jesus and I didn't want to give into temptation. Not giving into temptation didn't require much effort. Boys weren't very interested in me anyhow - I was a skinny geek with braces and glasses.

There was minimal sex ed at school - a little bit tacked onto the science class in the reproduction unit. In the test, I couldn't remember the term for condom, so I called it a joey. I learnt about menstruation in science class too. All I knew was a period was something I wanted become a woman, but once I got it, it wasn't so exciting after all.

My friend, Tania was going out with an older guy, Shane. Shane helped run youth group. Youth group had lots of fun outings. Shane took me for a ride on a motorbike at a camp - I was on the front in charge of the steering and throttle and he was on the back handling gear shifts. Shane drove a van around in circles with a rope tied to the back with a donut with youths on the back. It was wild, it was fun - that's about as wild as it got being in "on fire" for God.

Shane and Tania were often lying together fully clothed, pashing and groping. It made me feel uncomfortable - disgusted even. They may has well been having sex with their clothes on. At least get a room so the rest of us didn't have to see it. I longed for a boyfriend, but some of the physical acts repulsed me - I didn't even enjoy hugs, how would I cope with being intimate with someone?

I didn't get asked to go the school senior ball. Tania suggested I ask Matt. Matt was very quiet and kept to himself in class. Matt accepted. He was quite good looking, but there was no spark and he wasn't an option anyway as he wasn't a christian. He phoned a few times afterwards.

The following year, I was surprised to actually get asked to the ball. I was suspicious, "why do you want to take me?" "Neither of us have partners. Someone to go with," he said. I agreed to go.

When Tania and Shane broke up, Shane went out with a few other girls from youth group. When mum said he was interested in me, I freaked out. I don't to go out with someone that's already gone out with everyone else. I don't even find him remotely attractive.

I felt awkward with Shane from then on. He sat next to me. I ignored him. We didn't speak. Some time later, he approached me in church, to ask if I had a boyfriend. I said there was someone I was interested in, which was true. I was truthful to a fault and was glad I didn't have to tell him that I was "free and single" or even worse, tell a lie.

When Tanya became pregnant out of wedlock, her family were deeply ashamed. There were plenty of other pregnancies out of wedlock in our church too - I got to hear all about the "shame their parents experienced with their children going off the rails."

Years later, I learned of an secret abortion in God's "flock." It was secret, because they knew pregnancies were too shameful. I guess pregnancy proved that they were having sex. I wasn't having sex. I didn't even get to first base. I didn't even know what first base was.

Blind to Flirting

I worked at McDonalds during university holidays. Last time I'd seen Jesse was when he was in my class at primary school, when we were about 5 years old. Now we were both around 19. He was a bit of a 'bad boy' - he smoked and liked to get drunk - neither of which I'd ever done.

He called me 'Darling' - being a smart-arse I thought. 'Here's your burger, Darling,' he'd drawl & emphasis the word darling. He only acted that way to me, not any of the others.

When I was by my locker, he'd call from the lunchroom 'Darling...do you have any cigarettes?' I thought he was showing off to the others in the lunchroom, so I replied in the same mock affection tone, 'No, I don't, Sweetpea. I don't smoke.' There was sniggering in the lunchroom.

Another time, I was in the lunchroom alone, and he came in and started chatting to me, being more 'normal.' Then, instead of going to the men's changing rooms to change into his uniform, he casually stripped off to his underwear in the lunchroom. I pretended not to notice.

I was scooping up french fries, and he came up behind me and grabbed me around the hips, startling me, yet triggering a pleasurable electrical sensation. I'd never had that happen when someone touched me.

Another time, I turned around after closing my locker and he was standing behind me and he fell towards me, slamming his hands into the locker on either side of my head. His face came close to mine and then he pulled away. I just stared back.

I went back to university, baffled by his behaviour. I was too naive and clueless to see he had been flirting with me, and he must have thought I was a strange girl, being unresponsive to his advances.

University Years - Male Friends

University was a chance for me to leave home and spread my wings and enjoy more freedom. I was still heavily involved in christianity though. I made lots of male friends at university, both christians and non-christians. I'd still never had a boyfriend.

Hans was tall and blonde, with Dutch ancestry and very respectable. My father was blonde, Dutch and very respectable. Maybe that's why Hans and I clicked - he reminded me of my father. Hans invited me out to the movies. It was supposed to be a group outing with two romantically involved couples, including Vanessa (translation: christian date that wasn't called a date). In the end, one-and-a-half couples pulled out and I went to the movie with two males - Hans and his friend minus the girlfriend.

The movie was Dancing with Wolves starring Kevin Costner. There were some romantic scenes. Despite being a serious scientist like Hans, I was a romantic at heart. Hans made a comment during a sexually intimate scene, something like, "cover your eyes." I wouldn't have objected if he brushed my hand or kissed me. He didn't. Nothing remotely romantic happened. We were always just friends, that eventually drifted apart.

Months later, Vanessa told me that she and several people were certain Hans and I were going to get together - apparently it was obvious we liked each other. It hadn't been obvious to me. I doubt it was obvious to Hans either. Vanessa was curious to why we didn't end up a couple. I had no idea.

Josh was a sweet christian male a few years older than me. We were both studying chemistry and were musicians. We also both had smiles plastered permanently on our faces. He taught me a few things on guitar and bass guitar. I already played piano, and it was easy for me to pick up the riffs he taught me. He commented, "you'll make a hot bass-woman."

I had a secret crush on Josh occasionally, just like with Hans. Nothing happened. Hans was a version of my father. Josh was a male version of myself.

Hans is still a christian and has a wife and several children. Josh is also a christian and never married - he's still waiting for God to provide the woman of his dreams. I suspect the woman of his dreams will remain that - in his dreams.

There were a few creepy christian males that were interested in me. One was a very good-looking teen of Italian extract with a creepy personality. He turned up to my flat and said it was possessed by demons. He was deep and intense and was always talking about demons and lust which I found disturbing. Pentecostal christians believed they could cast out demons - the fallen angels of Satan - it was something I always found creepy - I started to become paranoid demons were lurking everywhere.

Another was a much older man, Dwyane, a scientist with a PhD that associated with the younger people in the university group. He had an odd manner which make me feel uncomfortable, which I can't put my finger on - like he was very inhibited and not embracing his masculine side. Plus he must have been nearly twice my age. He left a note on my door with a bag of plums telling me to arrive at his house for dinner at 7pm. I didn't turn up. I've since learnt that he has Asperger's and bipolar.

A lot of people with Asperger's Syndrome never have a romantic relationship and never marry. Dwyane's Asperger's was far more obvious than mine. I was a pretty good actor and could act bubbly even and smile all the time, even though I am an extreme introvert. I didn't know about AS then. I don't bother smiling all the time anymore - I have a neutral face most of the time.

There was a nice non-christian boy, Chase, that asked me out on a date - to see Pink Floyd. I'd been taught all secular music was of the devil, so I politely declined. Plus, I thought it was pointless dating pagan boys - I knew I was not to be "unevenly yoked with unbelievers."

First Love

I didn't feel attracted to people easily and I've only been "in love" a few times.

My first love was Daniel. Daniel played the drums. I'd been wanting to learn to play the drums for years. Daniel was tall, dark and handsome and was a pentecostal christian. He told other people I was a "hot christian." I didn't realise I was smitten with him until after we'd been friends for over a year. He was the closest male friend I'd ever had. "Closer than brother and sister," he'd said. Once I was brave enough to ask if he thought I was attractive. "Definitely," he said. I felt all warm and fuzzy inside when he said that.

He had short curly hair. I wondered what it would have been like to stroke it. I kept my hands firmly to myself. We'd hugged a few times, that's all. Just like lots of christians hug each other. I was scared to admit my feelings to him. I was scared he wouldn't want to be my friend anymore, if he knew I liked him more than a friend.

Here I was about 19 years old, with the sexual immaturity of a 13-year-old. Daniel lived by the coast where my family took summer holidays. He said he wanted to catch up over the university summer holidays. Next time I went on holiday to the beach with my family, I contacted him. He invited my family to church.

After church, I went to the beach with him and his friends. I sat on the beach with the girls and all the boys went out to sea with on their surf-boards. It sucked. My parents were mad with me for ruining their day over a boy. Dad teased me calling Daniel's name. Mum told me not to waste my time on a boy that clearly didn't love me back.

Mum walked into my room when I was having a pleasant dream about Daniel. Mum said, "This room is so warm and full of love. Have you been praying?"

Back at uni with Daniel, I was hoping romance would blossom. I was waiting for him to make the first move. I wasn't the type to throw myself at guys.

Unfortunately, at this time, I was starting to become ill. I was developing anxiety and depression from an illness that would go undiagnosed for years. I felt like I was going crazy. Daniel was scared off - he was hot and cold for months.

I told him to stop messing with my head - was he interested in me or not? It was coming up to my 21st birthday. Daniel confessed he secretly went out with another girl and had considered going out with me on the rebound. He told me I wasn't wife material. The next girl he wanted to go out with was for marriage. It wasn't me. The end.

I was deeply hurt by Daniel's rejection. I sobbed to Vanessa and another friend. The pain of rejection affected me for years.

He married Vanessa, who was on the prowl for a male that wanted marriage. Vanessa said God brought them together. Given Vanessa's track record for snagging any guy she pursued, I was doubtful that God had much to do with it.

Years later, Daniel asked me in front of Vanessa why I no longer went to church. I felt upset and didn't want to talk about it. He asked, "Is it because of me? It's not that I don't find you attractive...." I felt even more upset. Vanessa sat there looking unconfortable. Here he was flattering himself by thinking I rejected church because he rejected me. I hoped Vanessa gave him a clip around the ear-hole.

What a dork! (Daniel, not me).  I came to understand that people can be attracted to others for no rhyme or reason.  Something had attracted me to him even though rationally, he wouldn't have made a good husband for me.

A Happy Ending?

I was ill with depression for a long time. I had to quit university. I was too sick to work. I still believed in God but I was experiencing a lot of hurt in the church over my illness, which was the beginning of my deconversion from christianity.

I gave up on guys - they weren't worth the heartbreak. Also, what sane male would be interested in me when I was now an emotional wreck?

My teenage nephew has a girlfriend. It's kind of sweet. I've never met her, but have seen their pics on facebook.

How did I end up marrying a fantastic man and have his baby? Was he a man of God? He was top of his class in scripture at a private Anglican school he went to for few years, and his nana wanted him to be a minister - so he jokes that's close enough. He's been the best thing to come into my life. Our son inherited Asperger's Syndrome.

Finally ending up in a relationship and marrying a very kind and decent man? That's another story.

*names have been changed

Comments

Sally's Trove profile image

Sally's Trove 18 months ago

Yours is an amazing chronicle. You write in the voice of many young girls for whom finding and sustaining a relationship with the opposite sex is nearly impossible, while everyone around them is doing it. Asperger's or not, you are not alone, and you strike a chord.

This is a truly beautiful account of growing up as a girl whose fears and insecurities, and also the conflicts between beliefs and disbeliefs, make it difficult to make that connection that leads to a fulfilled romantic relationship.

Thank you so much for sharing.

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 18 months ago

Sally - thanks so much for the kind comments. I wasn't sure if this hub connected with anyone as no comments. When some people did say I was beautiful (some even said I could have been a model)- I didn't believe them because I lacked confidence. I probably came across as weird (probably still do - LOL). Finding out about Asperger's because of my son was hugely revelational to me - I wasn't defective & a loser all my life, I was socially different to others and all my struggles made sense.

marisuewrites profile image

marisuewrites 18 months ago

Hi Bailey, your story touched me deeply, but left me feeling frustrated and sad...did you not have anyone to talk to as these events unfolded in your life?

I think you were normal in nearly every sense of the word, and I believe you would not have been so hard on yourself if you had seen yourself through the eyes of someone who loved you.

So glad you've found your mate, and I'm sure have vowed to be there for your son in the emotional rivers of life.

Be well, and remember the beauty you possess.

I grew up as a Christian and am still one today, but my experiences were very different. I never saw God as anything but loving, instructing, and letting us learn from our mistakes.

We had many discussions about life in our home, my parents were always "explaining" good and evil. I didn't expect God to deliver me from much, but more to "get me thru it." LOL

I feel your heaviness when you talk about religion for you as a child. I wish I had known you then, and we could have danced our way through some tough times. =)

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 18 months ago

marisue - it was something I kept to myself. I found the whole religious thing psychologically damaging, which I have also written some hubs about

marisuewrites profile image

marisuewrites 18 months ago

Yes, I can see where your religious experience was negative. But know, that it is not for all. Just as you feel the absence of God, many feel His presence.

I don't preach; =) We each find our strength for our journey...I think you have remarkable endurance.

That resilience and enduring character are the ingredients for excellence, and some seem to never find it, so you are way ahead in life, at least the way I see it...

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 18 months ago

marisue - thanks for not preaching. Looking back, as I started developing mental illness in my teens (and my emotions came to the fore), that was when I thought I was closer to God.

I guess all these difficult things have made me a stronger person inside.

Jane Bovary profile image

Jane Bovary Level 1 Commenter 17 months ago

Baileybear,

I think you have to have a certain strength and self-confidence to write about such a painful topic with such honesty.

So many girls seem to take a dive in confidence in their teenage years, even if they've been very confident children. I suppose has something to do with all the pressures and expectations that are thrown upon them.I never had the religious complication, but it was painful enough.

Anyway,I was glad to read that story had a happy ending.

Cheers

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 17 months ago

Jane,

I expect there are more pressures these days - teens are very concerned with how they look and what their social life is like - stuff that isn't most important to me.

The teen and young adult years can be confusing.

Elefanza profile image

Elefanza Level 1 Commenter 17 months ago

Thanks for sharing something so vulnerable! I feel as though I can relate in some ways. I went to a religious high school that was known as the whore house on the hill. Everything was so overly sexualized that I was so completely turned off by dating. I think that and other factors really added to my innate fear of guys. If I hadn't already met my now husband (a geek like me), I would have not had any or very few romantic experiences. Guys seemed somewhat dull to me and I wanted to be a good girl too. Besides, why be interested in guys when there's such tasty food or good books available? :) Oddly enough, I've found a surprising hilarity at times for my self-inflicted prudishness. I'm lucky to have found someone who teaches me to laugh.

Anyway, I'm curious about one of your comments. You talked about how you felt like you were closer to God when you were hurting. It seems like that is the common experience of people, the thread that many who experience God share in common. Rarely do you hear a happy, well-adjusted person tell of finding God. Why? I know scientists say that Ezekiel even probably suffered from some mental disorder. Lately, I'm trying to figure out the explanation for what is trully happening when people say they experience God. Is it really God or something in the brain? Or some other factor we have no name for yet?

Also, can that "experience of God" be replicated by those who have no belief in God (and by this, I mean the experience of a deep peace)? Finally (and on this I'm adding an assumption that your feeling close to God was a good thing as I rarely hear accounts to the contrary), have you been able to replicate those good experiences since leaving the faith? Things like peace or joy? In any case, I'm curious and any insight you could add would be quite valued.

Peace

~Elefanza

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 17 months ago

Elefanza

I'm glad someone can relate about my self-imposed prudishness. I'm grateful to have married a man that makes me laugh too, because I'm rather serious most of the time (although some say they love my wit).

Can you please point out the bits about God? I actually felt like God was very far away when I was hurting. I'd like to clarify any parts that are confusing to the reader. Thanks for reading and commenting. I've written some hubs about my deconversion from christianity which might help answer your questions.

Yes, I can replicate those things - I get "high" on natural food chemicals. I can also go into a "right-brained" trance state doing something enjoyable like improvising on piano. I don't think it's God - I think it's the brain (and also hypnotism).

I am happier and have more peace being out of religion (intially it brought up awful feelings, as I was questioning my world view).

These hubs touch on this, but I want to write so much more about mental illness, food sensitivities, aspergers, religious abuse and how they are all linked for me. It's all about having so much to write and not enough spare time to!

http://hubpages.com/hub/Ex-Christian-from-believer

http://hubpages.com/hub/Ex-Christian-Throwing-the-

http://hubpages.com/hub/Treatment-Resistant-Depres

epigramman profile image

epigramman 17 months ago

....nor have I - some things are just better that way!!!

Sarah Masson profile image

Sarah Masson 17 months ago

Thanks for sharing your story, this was very interesting

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 17 months ago

epigramman - LOL!

Sarah - thanks for reading

magnoliazz profile image

magnoliazz Level 2 Commenter 16 months ago

Bailey Bear- I am so happy for you that you found a good man and had children with him. You really went through hell growing up while all the time, I am sure many of the men in your life were actually in love with you, but with no encouragement from you they did not know what to do. But then, maybe it all turned out for the best after all, maybe God was looking out for you and wanted you to have the perfect guy for you.

I hope you find your faith again. God is perfect, but people are not. I do think some religions take the guilt factor way too far. I have stopped going to church years ago because I have had enough of religion, and in the end I have a better relationship with God than ever before.

As Highvoltagewriter, a hubber who went from Satanist to Christian will tell you, after religion try Jesus.

My prayers are with you Bailey, and I would like to apologize to you about the way I acted toward you before. I hope you can forgive me for some of the assified remarks I made.

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 16 months ago

magnoliazz - yes I'm glad I married a good man and had his child. I no longer believe in God - I wrote about my de-conversion story in my two ex-christian hubs

tonymac04 profile image

tonymac04 16 months ago

Great Hub and a very sad story, though with such a great and happy ending. It is amazing to me how churches mess with our heads about something as beautiful and natural as sex. So many people are hung up about it and waste a lot of time feeling guilty when they should feel exquisite joy!

I think that prudishness is evil - even Jesus said that our bodies are temples, not things to be ashamed of and hidden away!

Thanks for sharing this.

Love and peace

Tony

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 16 months ago

tonymac - yes, religion certainly did a lot of damage to me psychologically. I did not feel comfortable with the idea of sex for years, even when married.

I also felt like some kind of reject that I'd never had a 'real' boyfriend until my husband. I found this hub quite embarrassing to share.

If he hadn't have pursued me, I wonder if I'd ever had married?

Being undiagnosed AS made things more complicated - I just didn't seem to 'connect' to people. I just smiled and pretended I was happy, telling myself that Jesus loved me, yet I was so desperately lonely.

graceomalley profile image

graceomalley Level 4 Commenter 16 months ago

Baileybear- Elefanza above asked you to say more about your statement about feeling close to God when you were hurting, and you asked where you said that, b/c the opposite was true. - I think Elefanza was refering to your statement(it was in the comments, not the hub) that you felt most close to God at a time when you were suffering from mental illness. This seems very different - feeling close to God during a period of mental illness would make many see god as a delusion, while feeling close to god while hurting makes most attached to God.

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 16 months ago

graceomalley - yes, my point is the more mentally unwell I was, the more 'spiritual' I felt, and the more deluded I was. In my hub 'Throwing the Baby Out with the Bathwater' I mentioned an evangelical leader Frank Houston - he was 'on fire' for God and had a huge following. The rest of the time, he was unwell with psychotic episodes. It was revealed late in his life that he abused minors.

Rod Marsden profile image

Rod Marsden Level 4 Commenter 16 months ago

I think you beat the odds, Baileybear. I don't know so much about women but there are a lot of lonely guys out there who have become lonely because of religion. A lot of people no doubt live like monks and nuns who have not signed up to do so and feel put out by the whole damn thing.

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 16 months ago

Rod - I agree there are plenty of lonely people out there because of religion. I was brought up in a very strict family.

I recall a girl in the open brethren (less strict than the closed brethren) that moved in with her boyfriend. There was a huge scandal around the christian churches & her family were very fast to ensure she broke up with her boyfriend.

The book I just read about a young man that escaped the exclusive brethren. Once he finally had sex, he was totally excommunicated.

Rod Marsden profile image

Rod Marsden Level 4 Commenter 16 months ago

Excommunication started out as a Catholic idea. It is amazing how many of these cults and penny ante Christian outfits have adopted the idea. I don't believe there are any biblical references to anyone having the power the excommunicate anyone else. I could, of course, be wrong.

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 16 months ago

Rod - I think it may be based on OT laws about having 'unclean' people having to leave the camp and the not mixing new and old cloth etc.

Don't see how they can possibly evangelise to people if they excommunicate anyone who questions them and won't mix with unbelievers.

Rod Marsden profile image

Rod Marsden Level 4 Commenter 16 months ago

Excommunication doesn't have to be permanent. King John of England was excommunicated by the pope and later, after John repented and did penance, the excommunication was lifted. John sinned by getting the Church to pay tax in England. In any event, during the Middle Ages excommunication was the strongest weapon the pope had against the nobles of Europe.

Excommunication meant you were no longer a Christian and so it was okay with the Church if other rulers that are Christian invade your land and take what they want from you. It was treaties worked out by marriage and offspring that kept the European rulers from not being always at each other's throats. A marriage, in a sense, can be made null and void, however, when you bring in excommunication.

Of course excommunication may be used in an entirely different way and have a somewhat different meaning when used by other Christians in a different time and place.

Mixing with non-believers is completely different from mixing with, say, heretics. A non-believer simply does not know and needs to be educated. A heretic is someone who knows and has turned his back on the word or has disobeyed a higher up church authority.

Martin Luther was excommunicated. He was also considered to be a heretic by the pope of his day. Questions are fine just so long as they are not the wrong questions. Martin Luther asked the wrong questions.

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 16 months ago

Rod - The books I've read so far about cults where excommunication took place - they only had to question the leaders rules and they could get kicked out. None of their former family etc were allowed to talk to them - this was for 3 different cults. If they were prepared to come back, repent and obey all the strict rules, they could come back in, but they would still be ostracised on the inside for their sins.

Would not all demoninations/sects be because of disagreements? The heretic starts a new branch. I notice a lot more christians these days call themselves non-denominational.

Rod Marsden profile image

Rod Marsden Level 4 Commenter 16 months ago

Well Luther was a heretic and he started the protestant movement.

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 16 months ago

Rod - of course many of the christians here on HP claim that protestants don't have catholic roots

Rod Marsden profile image

Rod Marsden Level 4 Commenter 15 months ago

I think we both know better, Baileybear. The word protestant comes from protest so they had to of had something to protest about. Luther started off as a Catholic monk. Of course when he married there was no going back to that life. Henry VIII started the Church of England also known as the Anglican Church when the pope wouldn't give him the divorce he wanted.

just to confuse matters there are Christians that are neither Catholics nor Protestants. Greek orthodox and Russian orthodox being the two that I know about.

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 15 months ago

Rod, it's all very complicated, isn't it? The Brethren (open & exclusive) come from the church of England if I recall correctly, which came from the Roman Catholics, but the Brethren didn't have protestant roots?

Some of these cult leaders had a religious background, usually christian too

Rod Marsden profile image

Rod Marsden Level 4 Commenter 15 months ago

Yes it can get complicated but any break away cult, etc from the Church of England definitely has Protestant roots.

Trish_M profile image

Trish_M Level 6 Commenter 15 months ago

I think that the teenage years can be very difficult. I suffered a lot with depression at that time. And I think that 'religion' contributed to it.

I, too, only had one boyfriend ~ who is now my husband. We met when I was 18 and we have been together for 35 years :)

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 15 months ago

Trish - sounds like we have a lot in common - only 1 boyfriend, like science etc

Trish_M profile image

Trish_M Level 6 Commenter 15 months ago

Hi Baileybear ~ Yes, seems that way :)

The Red Baron profile image

The Red Baron 14 months ago

Sorry to hear about your experience with Hillsong, more sorry that its turned you off Christianity altogether. I am a Christian myself but I am one of the few who see Hillsong for the corruption that it is.

Here is a link to my page that aims to expose their corruption. http://www.facebook.com/pages/Hillsong-Church-What

Whenever I comment on their facebook page it is deleted without any comment and they then block me. It is easier to delete it than to deny something they cant deny.

Here are a few links you may find interesting:

The first is an American cult watch site that monitors Hillsong and collects article on them

http://www.rickross.com/groups/hillsong.html

These are 2 websites that discuss extreme religion and most of the contributers are ex HillSong

http://groupsects.wordpress.com/

http://signposts02.wordpress.com/

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 14 months ago

Red Baron - I didn't think I mentioned Hillsong in this hub. I did a review of a book by a woman that had a terrible experience with Hillsong (my hub 'Throwing the Baby Out With the Bathwater'), and also I used to sing songs by Hillsong in my church days.

I've come across the rickross website when I was researching for my book review hubs about extreme cults. Will check out the other links - thanks

The Red Baron profile image

The Red Baron 14 months ago

No you didn't. I read a few of your hubs.

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 14 months ago

Red Baron - thought you might have

mathsciguy profile image

mathsciguy 12 months ago

Man, it's almost as if I knew you! Your story reminds me very closely of that of one of my friends from years ago, to whom I haven't spoken in ages but miss dearly. She was very conservative and had been raised to be a godly woman, whereas I was just beginning to have the first inklings of doubt in the faith I inherited from my upbringing (this was when I was younger, of course). I was absolutely captivated by her, though, but in the end it seemed that my wandering heart was my undoing with her.

Anyhow, I feel that I can relate to your quite interesting story - I was 19 before I was ever kissed. Only beat you by a couple years.

:)

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 12 months ago

mathsciguy - I'm sure I would have still been very shy & conservative even if I hadn't have been brought up in a strict religious family. And of course, I would have been just as blind to any interest with the Asperger's.

miccimom profile image

miccimom Level 2 Commenter 10 months ago

I am sure that your will help alot of people out there that experienced the same as you. I enjoyed reading this Hub. I too am a Chistian, but I never had those types of pressures put on me about sex or dating growing up. I also was shy with boys as a kid. Just my thought, in life sometimes we have to go through obstacles in our journey to finally reach our destination. And even then, the journey has to continue with unexpected joys and sorrows. My experience is that even though God seems like he has "checked out" sometimes, he does show up when it counts. I wish you many happiness with your marriage now!

Baileybear profile image

Baileybear Hub Author 10 months ago

miccimom - I wasn't sure if I wanted to write this or not, because I found it embarrassing to admit. But there's plenty of people in the same boat. I have since started a website about Asperger's and a blog about not believing in god anymore

Submit a Comment
Members and Guests

Sign in or sign up and post using a hubpages account.



    • No HTML is allowed in comments, but URLs will be hyperlinked
    • Comments are not for promoting your Hubs or other sites

    Please wait working